Medical Billing Forum
Medical Billing Software => Medical Billing Software Reviews => : PMRNC August 29, 2012, 02:14:16 PM
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Kareo Recognized as the Fastest Growing Medical Office Software Company by Inc. Magazine
http://www.kareo.com/news/press-releases/2012-08-28-kareo-recognized-as-fastest-growing-medical-office-software-company
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I saw this post earlier today when I was doing some research and it definitely gives me a little more confidence in making the switch to Kareo.
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I believe it; they seem to be growing like gangbusters. That is awesome for them. Hopefully they'll keep up the good work.
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I would NOT recommend Kareo to anyone. They have great review on websites (most of which they have paid to be on ) and some forums. But for those of us that use them, they tell a very different story. Their support team is absolutely horrible. I have to pay a support fee (between $100 and $200 monthly in addition to your monthly service fee) to talk to someone. They offer chat support, but the hold time to chat with a rep is at least and hour. Recently I waited 3 hours only to have the rep tell me I was taking to much time because she didn't know the answer to my question. If you read the community forum it really tels the story. But of course you can't access the forum unless you sign up for the service. And to make matters worse, they are fully aware of the problems users are having but aren't interested in fixing any of them. They are cheap compared to some other services and that's why they are growing. I really wish I'd found more honest reviews before I signed up for them. So for those considering using Kareo, I would call them and start asking some hard questions about their clearinghouse problems, posting issues and the mess they have made of fee schedules and contract. Watch them dance around the questions. If you sign up with them you will regret it...I sure do >:(
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If you search this forum, you will find posts that state bluntly that Kareo is not good for beginning users because they are not user-friendly - as you have stated.
Because of the Federal push toward electronic billing, you are going to find everywhere that the IT folks have a captured audience in small-practice doctors. EMR and PM folks can raise their prices and cut their services and the doctors have to use them anyway if they don't want to be penalized by Medicare. (Go free market, right???) The larger practices and doctor-groups who have their own IT staff are a bit more immune to this. But not much.
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I would NOT recommend Kareo to anyone. They have great review on websites (most of which they have paid to be on ) and some forums. But for those of us that use them, they tell a very different story.
Sorry, I have to disagree, as a user both myself and the clients that utilize Kareo are very happy.
Their support team is absolutely horrible. I have to pay a support fee (between $100 and $200 monthly in addition to your monthly service fee) to talk to someone. They offer chat support, but the hold time to chat with a rep is at least and hour. Recently I waited 3 hours only to have the rep tell me I was taking to much time because she didn't know the answer to my question.
The max plan is $299 per provider and I've received nothing but awesome support, Since my clients have their own accounts they absorb the costs. IF I maintained their accts, and since I charge flat monthly pricing, this amount could be included in the per client costs to which I add to the flat monthly fee.
If you read the community forum it really tels the story. But of course you can't access the forum unless you sign up for the service. And to make matters worse, they are fully aware of the problems users are having but aren't interested in fixing any of them.
If you are talking about bugs or glitches, I can't really say I've experienced any using them and I've been using for a while now, a few years ago it seemed like a lot of fixes and bugs were needed but done efficiently and pretty quick. They were fast as heck with the 5010 updates and they provide MORE resources on the industry than any other vendor I've ever encountered (and I've probably used and/or seen 97% or more of the others) I've never seen them show lack of concern over a bug or a fix. Perhaps there are features some want/need that they can't accommodate immediately, but they wouldn't be any different from other vendors. Can't please all of the people, all of the time.
They are cheap compared to some other services and that's why they are growing.
I don't think that's a fair adjective since you've eluded to the costs being high. Cheap in regards to servicing and support? No, absolutely not. I'd not switch even for any of the free services. I'd rather pay for quality than get free that does not suit mine or my clients needs.
I really wish I'd found more honest reviews before I signed up for them. So for those considering using Kareo, I would call them and start asking some hard questions about their clearinghouse problems, posting issues and the mess they have made of fee schedules and contract. Watch them dance around the questions. If you sign up with them you will regret it...I sure do
When I talked to their references I maintained a lot of contact with them and also My community (PMRNC) has a LOT of Kareo users who are genuinely happy. I'm sure no one is 100% happy all the time, but I've not heard any negative experiences that I can remember. I have always told people that if you are NEW in the industry, Kareo might not be a good first choice in vendors. They are VERY upfront with their training/education info.. THEY do not train medical billers. If you HAVE never used any other PM system, you will indeed find Kareo to be a bit cumbersome and hard to maneuver and you will be disappointed in their lack of training newbies.
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It's good you have not had the horrible experience so many other users have. It is very expensive and time consuming to move from on system to another. And if Kareo could listen to their users, build better software then this would not be an issue. But, I'm very confused on why it's necessary to break down my post almost line for line in order to discount my statement. Obviously, your involvement with Kareo is more than an end user. You may be a paid advertiser which is fine, but I think we are all here to offer information on our personal experiences. Before deciding to go with Kareo, I wish I could have found information on the good, the bad and the ugly and made my decision from that. That’s all I’m trying to offer. I’ve been in the health insurance industry for over 15 years. My bachelor’s degree is in health care management and I hold multiple licenses and certifications. My “day job” is with one of the largest MCO in my service area. I manage a network of hundreds of providers resolving both front end and back end provider issues. I think it’s safe to say I’m not “new” to this industry. I feel any product built on a SaaS platform, such as Kareo, should deliver on the product they promote. For me Kareo did not deliver. It’s just that simple. But once again, that’s my experience and I’m glad your experience was more positive. My purpose in reading posts on this website was to get information on other programs available and this forum offered me very valuable information. Thank you to all those who take time from their busy day to share and give insight…including the young lady which scrutinized my post so harshly. ;)
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RGHS_2012:
1.) Will your budget allow you to purchase / lease the software that will do what you need it to do?
2.) Could you humor me and list some of the features you need in your work that Kareo can not handle - maybe in their order of importance to you. Folks here can maybe direct you to software that can do what you need it to do. But maybe that software is beyond the reach of your budget.
3.) The request in #2 is totally separate from this point: if you have not received a satisfactory response from Kareo, is it possible that the software maybe can do what you need, you just don't know how to make it happen?
4.) The users and the software developers are both caught between a rock and a hard place. Don't know how it is going to resolve itself, other than through forums like this one. Bootleg copies of Kareo are bound to show up. If they allow their user forums to be open to the general public, those who have pirated the software can figure out how to use it without needing to go through Kareo - and Kareo loses an income stream. Companies can't survive if they don't have income streams. But we can't learn how to use a product without instructions. What to do? If you can list some things here that you want Kareo to do, perhaps Kareo users here can help you out.
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Kareo has a billing service which they just started.
They charge 5- 8% and outsource the billing to India at 1%; they have a sales staff here.
How do I know?
They would admit that they outsource the billing offshore. I know the going rate in India. They probably do even better.
They hit a goldmine, charge 6% and sub contract at 1%; that is called free enterprise system.
Every major billing company does the same, Kareo just got on the bandwagon.
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I think this is really great. Billing company outsources to India. Insurance Carrier outsources to India. Insurance Carrier denies payment. Billing company call center calls the Insurance Carrier call center to resolve the issue. And we end up with Indian talking to Indian - in their native language, no doubt - resolving a health payment issue for an American. Great setup!
Not.
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Richard,
It explains a lot doesn't it. LOL.
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I believe the billers in Mumbai (or is it Chennoi?) are dancing to the latest Bollywood tunes, courtesy of their American employers - Kareo.
While people at Kareo are dancing to the Gangam Style, for hitting a goldmine.
That is life.
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It's good you have not had the horrible experience so many other users have. It is very expensive and time consuming to move from on system to another.
Oh don't I know that one from experience.. 5 times over. My lesson learned finally was not to rate a system by cost but by performance and quality. Lesson learned and received.
And if Kareo could listen to their users, build better software then this would not be an issue. But, I'm very confused on why it's necessary to break down my post almost line for line in order to discount my statement. Obviously, your involvement with Kareo is more than an end user.
Nope, not at all, in fact my clients have the relationship, I'm just the happy end user, No affiliate payments, no income and no paid advertising.
My purpose in reading posts on this website was to get information on other programs available and this forum offered me very valuable information. Thank you to all those who take time from their busy day to share and give insight…including the young lady which scrutinized my post so harshly. ;)
But did you not post in a public forum? the only reason I broke it out was so that there isn't confusion to what I was replying to. That's what the quote button and reply buttons are for. I don't think it's unfair to respond with positive feedback to a negative opinion. I was giving my opinion from my experience. Likewise If you had a positive experience you posted publicly about a company and I had a negative one I would post my experience as well.
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RichardP, thanks for the reply. And it’s a very interesting question you ask. Some of the features Kareo has would be great if they worked. I’ll give you an example. The clearinghouse reporting: I have a particular payer whose payer name and ERA are not functioning correctly. For the purpose of this example, let’s say it’s “Aetna”. When I receive the initial acknowledgement report the payer name will say “Aetna”. But when I receive an acknowledgement report letting me know the claim has been acknowledged by the insurance company the name will be BETTER HOME HEALTH. Then I receive a report letting me know the claim has been adjucated, the payer name is now ST JOHN SMART. Next I receive a report saying a remittance has been received, the payer name is now UMWA. But when I receive the remittance the payer is correctly listed as “Aetna”. Keep in mind every time this happens I click on the member and claim information and they have “Aetna” as they payer. I don’t bill to BETTER HOME HEALTH, ST JOHN SMART OR UMWA! At first I thought it was a fluke, but it continued to happen. I contacted the Kareo support team and was told it was a known issue. They have been working on fixing the problem, but the rep did not have a date on when it would be corrected. I’ve had this problem for over 6 months. When I got a call from an engineer, I told him about this issue and several others. He logged into my account and could see all these random payer names. His reply was “huh…that’s weird. Let me call Gateway and find out why that’s happening. I’ll give you a call back”. It’s been two weeks or more, and I’ve yet to hear from him again. So I called Gateway because this is also affecting the ERA from this same payer. If I get an ERA, only maybe half the payments can be auto assigned. The remainder I have to manual post. Gateway tells me I have to get with Kareo since the clearinghouse is integrated into Kareo’s system and what I described is a Kareo problem not a Gateway problem. And that’s just one of the MANY problems I’m having with Kareo. That’s not an end user problem, that’s a functionality problem!
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I know you didn' t address me and maybe my 2 cents doesn't apply to your situation, however I do have some payers that come through on remittance under the "group plan name" rather than the payor, From what I can tell it appears this happens with the ERISA based plans that contract out. For example we have one particular company that is rather large here and they contract out with Cigna and their remittances come back with their plan/company name rather than Cigna, but we can of course cross reference upon further looking at the remittance. Now if you are getting random groups.. you have no record of or patients with employee's of those companies, I would agree that is bizarre. ON all of our remittances through Kareo that come through this way however we can still see that Cigna (in my example) is the payor.
If I get an ERA, only maybe half the payments can be auto assigned. The remainder I have to manual post.
OK, I am going to give you this one all the way and be fair. I DO NOT LIKE THE AUTO Posting and do NOT use it.. in all fairness I never thought it a good idea myself out of my OWN personal feelings. I don't care how busy I am, the only data I'm trusting is my own.. auto posting was NEVER a feature I wanted nor trusted.. I have seen this feature in other PM solutions and have to also say it's "iffy" at best. I just don't trust the whole concept. I want to post my own payments but I suppose if one prefers the auto posting and it was not working properly I would be a little miffed myself.
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Some of the features Kareo has would be great if they worked.
We are in brand new territory here. It is going to be a while before we even know what are the right questions to ask, nevermind what are the answers. With the government pushing electronic everything in health care, a number of organizations are trying to provide solutions for the offices that want to comply, but don't have mega-bucks for hardware, software, and an IT staff. The HL7 Interface Standards are designed to help make this happen - by allowing different software programs to talk to each other. But like with any new technology, it will take a while to work out the kinks.
http://www.hl7standards.com/blog/2010/03/04/hl7-interface-an-overview/
One of our clients wanted to use Practice Fusion (and now does), so I dug in and learned how it works. Documentation was slim, but Q&A on the Internet provided a wealth of information. One of the major complaints was the lack of ability to pass info between Practice Fusion and Kareo (this being a complaint directed at Kareo, not PF). The technology companies on thin budgets like Practice Fusion, Kareo, Office Ally, and others are going to take baby steps in implementing the features of their programs as well as the HL7 connection (think how many payors they need to be able to "talk" to through the HL7 interface). Little by little, new features are incorporated and brought on-line. (It seems like every few weeks, some new feature is brought to life on Office Ally.) The larger organizations that have the big bucks to bring a more complete product to market are also going to charge the bigger buck for that product. If you cannot afford the more expensive (and more complete / useable) programs, you have no choice but to settle for programs that don't yet do what you need them to do.
On the other hand, if your doctor has 10 or fewer full-time employees, Medicare will allow you to send paper claims. The non-Medicare insurance carriers will have their own standard - but I haven't encountered one yet that will not accept paper claims or send out paper EOBs.
If you find an inexpensive program that will do everything you need, in the way you want it done, please be sure to post that information here. I think it will be a long while before you find such a program.
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Richard, since you asked, here are some programs where EHR and PM are fully integrated.
1 Mitochon: small California company free to providers, makes money by advertisements
2. Healthfusion/ Medi touch; one of the best. My favorite.
3. ichartsmd; very reasonably priced, they claim to white label a new platform for Kareo, available soon.
4. Advanced MD; expensive but very good.
5. Greenway; Public company, very good.
There are many others.
Kareo is a system not good, but not bad either; they are very popular, because they advertise to the hilt, and pay high commissions to the sales agents. They also offer low prices with minimal or no support.
And send their back office work to India, money, money and more money.
Imagine you sell a tomato for a dollar but it costs you only ten cents.
I am not sure these tomatoes are any good.
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RichardP you make a very good point. The changes coming to health care and insurance are requiring all of us to look ways to meet the requirement. I’m sure we will eventually look back on this, wipe the sweat from our brow, thank God we made it through and have a little chuckle…those of us who last through all this mess. :-\
Tallmanusa you hit the nail on the head!!!
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RichardP you make a very good point. The changes coming to health care and insurance are requiring all of us to look ways to meet the requirement. I’m sure we will eventually look back on this, wipe the sweat from our brow, thank God we made it through and have a little chuckle…those of us who last through all this mess.
Here's something many providers and billing companies are NOT looking at... how will providers deal with the patients who resist the technology? My own attorney is involved in that whole other rhelm :)
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... how will providers deal with the patients who resist the technology?
According to the conspiracy theorists on the internet, there are FEMA camps already prepared for these folks. :-\
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Kareo has a billing service which they just started.
They charge 5- 8% and outsource the billing to India at 1%; they have a sales staff here.
How do I know?
They would admit that they outsource the billing offshore. I know the going rate in India. They probably do even better.
They hit a goldmine, charge 6% and sub contract at 1%; that is called free enterprise system.
Every major billing company does the same, Kareo just got on the bandwagon.
It's shocking to see Kareo doing it. Are their providers aware that their business is being subcontracted to India? Isn't mandatory for Kareo to let their clients know about it before sending their business to India?
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I believe it's only their billing service, not their providers claims info. Believe me I already made that inquiry ::) >:(
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I think this is really great. Billing company outsources to India. Insurance Carrier outsources to India. Insurance Carrier denies payment. Billing company call center calls the Insurance Carrier call center to resolve the issue. And we end up with Indian talking to Indian - in their native language, no doubt - resolving a health payment issue for an American. Great setup!
Not.
LMAO!!! ::) ;D
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Kareo is not for the beginner biller for sure. I used it and did not like the Practice Fusion integration that required me to refresh the Kareo screen to see claims. I also think that it is too expensive to use as a billing company.
I did notice they started their own billing services. Kareo is very popular and their marketing team does an excellent job with promoting them. They also attend seminars and conferences so this gets their exposure out there as well. Practice Fusion is creating their own billing practice management portion now as well.
I would hope they do not offshore to India. If they do they will eventually loose those accounts. With the Sequester and everything else going on providers can afford to have their claims go over there, get screwed up and loose money.
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I believe it's only their billing service, not their providers claims info. Believe me I already made that inquiry ::) >:(
Hi Linda, forgive me if I was too ignorant, billing service means all the billing functions. isn't it? that means both patient info and claims info are handled in India. I thought there was a provision in HIPAA that says you should let your doctor that their actual billing is processed in India while the responsible Billing agent remains here in the US.
There's a reason behind me asking this. I understand quite a few big companies here go tell the doctors/hospitals that they will do their billing and once they get their business they quietly subcontract it to India or send to their own BPO's in India. But the doctors/hospitals might be thinking that everything is being processed here.
I am pretty sure that if these companies had to let their clients know while signing the contract that the billing is actually processed in India, many of the doctors would say NO.
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I believe it's only their billing service, not their providers claims info. Believe me I already made that inquiry ::) >:(
I am pretty sure that if these companies had to let their clients know while signing the contract that the billing is actually processed in India, many of the doctors would say NO.
I am sure you are right. Some would still do it to save money but just about all of them would be upset they were not aware of what was happening.
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RobertJ - Software as a Service (SaaS) companies provide Billing software and storage space on their own servers. For a fee, you can log onto the billing software (using the Internet) and use that software just like it was installed on your own computer wherever you are. Any data you input is stored on a server belonging to the company you are leasing the software from. Once all of the billing data has been processed, you send the data off to whatever clearinghouse you are using. The clearinghouse formats and forwards the data to the appropriate Insurance Carriers for payment. Maybe you know this already?
This service is what Kareo provided in the beginning. You do the actual billing work. You send the results of your billing work off to a clearinghouse. Kareo is only providing the billing software and hard drive storage space, for a fee. It shouldn't matter where in the world the software and servers are physically located (aside from security issues). You are the one who actually posts the DX and CPT codes and hook them together in the proper sequence.
What Kareo has offered recently is a billing service. Doctor forwards appropriate paperwork, or grants access to data in his EMR, and Kareo's hired billers do the actual posting of the DX and CPT codes into the billing software and hook them together in the proper sequence. Then they forward the completed billing work to the clearinghouse. The concern is that the people doing the actual billing in this instance are offshore - compared to the first instance where you were doing the actual billing, you were just using Kareo's software and storage space (located wherever).
For those who are not clear on the distinction: In the first instance, you do the actual billing, using software and storage space leased from Kareo; in the second instance, people hired by Kareo do the actual billing, presumeably using Kareo's software and storage space. The offshore concern would apply only to this second instance.
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Richard, I am pretty clear with the concept. My question is actually on the second instance. is it acceptable for a company here to hire offshore guys without letting the doctors know about it?
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Richard, I am pretty clear with the concept. My question is actually on the second instance. is it acceptable for a company here to hire offshore guys without letting the doctors know about it?
I have providers with contracts with Kareo, so I am looking further into it myself now.. FROM my understanding there are no limitations with HIPAA in regards to sharing PHI overseas.. ASIDE from that, I'm looking into whether IF it is happening as I have discussed with a few of my clients and they would like me to look into it further. I can tell you that in starting to research the legalities of offshore outsourcing private medial records overseas IN GENERAL, I have found out that there are actually state laws pending and enacted in 26 states in regards to offshore outsourcing. I have 5 pages of state laws to research and this fell on my plate right in the middle of it. I WILL have a problem if the work I AM DOING on kareo and on behalf of my clients is being sent offshore AND without disclosure of such, legal or not. If you find anything out further, let me know and I will do the same. In an email i sent I just got a canned response, not even worth mentioning. I also deal with someone else over there occasionally and they are unaware of offshore instances on their end, but I'm still looking because I was always taught..where there is smoke there is fire.
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Linda, I think this is an important issue - and I want to be sure I am understanding you correctly.
... if the work I AM DOING on kareo and on behalf of my clients is being sent offshore ...
The work you refer to in that quote - 1.) do you mean when you put in the DX and CPT codes and link them up and then send them to the clearinghouse? That work? 2.) Are you concerned about whether the software / servers / clearinghouse(s) that you are using, through Kareo, are located offshore?
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The work you refer to in that quote - 1.) do you mean when you put in the DX and CPT codes and link them up and then send them to the clearinghouse? That work? 2.) Are you concerned about whether the software / servers / clearinghouse(s) that you are using, through Kareo, are located offshore?
First let me be clear, these are concerns on mine and my clients behalf, they are regardless of legal issues., have not gotten that far. We are actually concerned with any connection to offshore in regards to ANY information (PHI) being sent overseas.
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Linda, I know your position on collecting fee slips and sending them offshore to have foreigners type the codes into the billing software and connect them. I was wondering if your comment in question above meant that you had the same attitude toward server farms that might be located offshore, even if you were the one typing in the codes for your doctors - such as you might do with Kareo if their server farms were located offshore.
You said We are actually concerned with any connection to offshore in regards to ANY information (PHI) being sent overseas. I take that to mean your concern extends to server farms that might be located offshore - since doctors' data would be stored on those offshore servers.
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No congrats to them! they just doubled there price for nothing just because they saw that they have a lot of clients! the billing services need to switch away from a company like this!
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No congrats to them! they just doubled there price for nothing just because they saw that they have a lot of clients! the billing services need to switch away from a company like this!
I wondered if that is really the case. I saw on their website they got rid of all of their pricing but the $299 a month option but I didn't know if they still offered the other options for people that really wanted them or already have them.
Does that mean that if you were on the $149 or $199 a month, or even the $69 a month one where you pay for claims, that they aren't grandfathering people in? Does everyone have to pay $299 a month per provider for existing ones or is that just for new providers that you sign up?
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I dont know what they do with existing customers, but you cant be from now their client for less then $299 a month per provider! and for that price it better to go with e-clinical works.
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I've just also found out that OfficeAlly has also begun their own billing company.
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I dont know what they do with existing customers, but you cant be from now their client for less then $299 a month per provider! and for that price it better to go with e-clinical works.
Is the charge only for using their PMS/EHR per month or does it also include all the scheduling, scanning, billing and posting for a provider?
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No congrats to them! they just doubled there price for nothing just because they saw that they have a lot of clients! the billing services need to switch away from a company like this!
I wondered if that is really the case. I saw on their website they got rid of all of their pricing but the $299 a month option but I didn't know if they still offered the other options for people that really wanted them or already have them.
Does that mean that if you were on the $149 or $199 a month, or even the $69 a month one where you pay for claims, that they aren't grandfathering people in? Does everyone have to pay $299 a month per provider for existing ones or is that just for new providers that you sign up?
The $299.00 is only for new customers. No additional burden on existing customers. You can check that out here. http://www.kareo.com/terms/pricing-policy
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For their billing services.. they list: 4-8% of Collections based on claim volume and specialty..Wonder how they are handling that in the states that prohibit physicians from fee-splitting arrangements?
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Wonder how they are handling that ...
Let's see .... (average collections for last 36 months times 7%) divided by 12 = new fixed month fee - subject to review and revision every 12 months.
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